Show & Tell - S&T chats with Gil Bitton of Endo

GIL BITTON of ENDO

OZZFEST, HOLMDEL, NJ
8.18.03 - 08.22.03

Second stage on Ozzfest is like boot camp. Spend a summer on second stage and go from green to veteran in 2 months flat. 15 minute sets, 5 minute changeovers, rotating time slots, thousands of kids that may or may not have ever heard of you...

Good or bad, you will come out the other side transformed.

Ozzfest 2003 was no different. Some second stage bands just survived, some thrived and, alas, some never made it to the final bell.

Already a fan of their music, we were eager to spend some time with Miami-based Endo to see how they were coping with life on Ozzfest. We caught up with singer Gil Bitton at the tour's Holmdel, NJ stop and again a few days later to wrap up by phone.

On stage, Gil is intensity personified; otherworldly and captivating. Off-stage, he had a calm about him that was near palpable. Perhaps it's the yoga...

Show & Tell: Tell me about finding out that you were going on Ozzfest.

Gil: I was on my way to my yoga class [laughs] and I got a phone call, and it was like, “You guys are doing Ozzfest.” I nearly dropped my phone, I was really so excited. It was totally at the last minute so I was, like, fucking really happy.

S&T: Did you know you were being considered, or was it a complete surprise?

G: Complete surprise. It’s the biggest tour of the summer, you know, and it’s obviously the heaviest tour of the summer. So what we’re doing is, we’re playing our heaviest set. We’re playing three songs from “Songs for the Restless” and the others from “Evolve,” which is the record before this, and that record’s more industrial, it’s heavier. [Ozzfest crowds] seem to appreciate the heavier stuff more, so we’re doing what we can do for right now.

S&T: So your set’s heavier because you anticipate the crowds to be heavier?

G: Yeah. You know, it’s kind of like, to adapt to a crowd you want to give ‘em what they want. And what they want is pure intensity. And we can give ‘em both. We can give ‘em melody, intensity, we can give ‘em anything. We can just adapt to any crowd, really.

S&T: What’s the reality [of the tour] been, as opposed to the anticipation? Now that you’re near the end, how does it compare to what you thought it would be?

G: It’s definitely a lot more than I thought it would be. We played some off-dates with Korn, which was just us and Korn. And [Marilyn] Manson, we played with Manson, which was like a dream come true for us. To meet all these people that you looked up to all these years...

S&T: I heard you checked out [our] site?

G: Yeah, and I was really, really impressed. Really happy with what you guys did, I appreciate it. I mean, comparing us to such great vocalists. It’s a great feeling.

S&T: I think in my review I said you sounded like a heavy metal hybrid of Morrissey and Peter Murphy. That sits well?

G: Yeah. I was just amazed. I was amazed that people could actually catch on to that. Because I’m a huge Bowie fan, I’m a huge Peter Murphy fan, I’m a huge Cure fan and the style of music we’re playing is obviously rock, so I try to bring a little more – I don’t want to say retro – maybe more of a goth type of feel. More of a darker, gothic feel to the rock music.

S&T: I’m a huge Bowie fan, and I think he doesn’t get enough credit for his influence on modern music. If you go back and listen to the stuff he did in the ‘70s, like “Lodger," “Low,” and "Heroes," there's even precursors to Industrial music.

But let’s jump back and then we’ll jump forward again. We were talking about Ozzfest, and what it’s like to tour with [Marilyn] Manson and Korn and so on.

G: Yeah, I really think Manson is an amazing performer. The theatrical... his music is very dark [yet] sort of soothing. I’m a huge Manson fan and a huge Korn fan as well. Well, when the first record came out I was a huge Korn fan. Now after meeting them and playing with them and getting to know just how cool they are as people, I’m an even bigger fan. So to play with them and to play with Manson was definitely a dream come true.

S&T: How did those dates happen? How did you hook up with them?

G: Um, our management knows Jonathan [Davis of Korn] personally, and they actually asked him and it was just kind of like that. That’s the way it works. I could go ahead and make up a story, but...

S&T: How has the band changed over the course of this tour?

G: Um, we definitely got tighter as a unit. We’re definitely, you know, aware of each other’s energy on stage as well as offstage. We’re getting along great. It’s just such a tough industry. We delivered a great record and now it’s up to the label and management to really push it.

S&T: I would imagine on a tour like this, it’s especially difficult because it’s not necessarily Endo fans out there. So you have to go out there, you have five songs, you have to get ‘em, build ‘em up, crescendo, get off stage and move on to the next show.

G: Exactly. It’s almost like, you gotta do the best you can for 25 minutes - give it your most energy, your most intensity - and there’s a lot of closed-minded people out there and there’s a lot of open-minded people, so it works both ways. You try to bring intensity, melody, everything you want in our set, even some theatrics. So I think we’re doing a pretty good job, the crowds have been really responsive. Actually, New York, today’s probably been the most unresponsive crowd of the whole tour. I think they’re a little tougher to please out here, but we did our best... and they seem to respond well. But we’re doing well.

S&T: I think the Ozzfest crowd in New Jersey skews a little hardcore.

G: Yeah. More like underground hardcore, I think. Whatever, they still seemed to like it.

S&T: What about preparing for a show in general? Do you have a warm-up?

G: I stretch. A little meditation, a lot of breathing. I try to get psyched up in my own way. Yeah, just trying to psyche myself up, trying to find the energy, trying to find the breath.

S&T: Well in person, sitting here, you’re very relaxed, mellow and then up on stage you’re aggressive and energized and manic. Is there a switch?

G: It’s basically the music. I think I’m really sensitive to my surroundings, and if there’s certain music that backs me up, I tend to go along with whatever backs me up. If it’s intense, if it’s an intensity behind me, pushing me, then it’ll push me into like, this alter ego or whatever you call it, that makes me a little insane, I guess.

S&T: Well that’s what it looks like, but it looks like a flip .

G: [laughs] A flip, yeah.

S&T: When does it stop? Backstage or when you get back on the bus?

G: I think it’s the crowd as well that really energizes me. I feel a lot of energy from the crowd. I just love being onstage and I think the fact that I am onstage, feeling that crowd and seeing that many people gives me... it flips a switch and intensifies my soul, I guess.

S&T: Is it exhausting?

G: It could be. It could be exhausting. Not for 25 minutes a day though. My voice is a little... you know, I’ve been out for two months, so I’m trying to keep my voice together.

S&T: What happens when this tour is over?

G: We don’t know. We’re talking about, um, a couple of tours. But I can’t say ‘cause nothing’s really definite. Hopefully something where we can play a full set, though. When we played with Manson and Korn, we played a 45-minute set which consists of a lot of songs that are on the album, like “Clean Sheets.” We play “Ruckus,” we play “Madness….”

S&T: That’s my favorite song.

G: Which one?

S&T: “Madness.”

G: Awesome. Me too.

S&T: Is it?

G: Yeah. Hopefully, you know, they should release that song.

S&T: On vibing off the music behind you, if someone in the band is having an off night, does that affect you?

G: Yeah, it does. If one of us is off, it definitely affects the rest of us. Today our bass player’s rig went off twice and I was feeling a little sick. We had two days off, and whenever we have two days off, we relax too much and it kind of sets us off a little. But I still think we had a good show.

S&T: Let’s talk about the album. Tell me about not being able to sleep [ed.'s note: Gil suffered from severe insomnia during the making of the aptly named Songs For The Restless].

G: What I was dealing with was more reactive. There were certain issues that, I won’t go into, but that made me an insomniac. So a lot of that time when I wasn’t sleeping, I was writing. So a lot of the lyrics and the music came from that sort of restlessness that I was feeling.

S&T: Are you sort of half-in, half-out? Is it that state where you’re certainly not asleep, but you’re not really fully awake either?

G: What I was going through... well, what I really believe, is that love is pain and pain is inspiration. So I was going through a tough time with a significant other and it created all this turmoil and it just got me to be creative, to write, and to be intuitive in a way. So I really welcomed it in a way, because it helped me write.

S&T: Right. And when you guys write, do you have lyrics first or music first?

G: It’s both. Sometimes I’ll come in with lyrics and see what someone does. They’ll put something behind it, or I’ll come in with a guitar riff. It’s a collaboration.

S&T: The new record is a pretty big leap forward from the first one. Is there intent [to take such a decidely different direction]? There was a couple of years in between, and then there’s also different band members.

G: So have you heard [the first album, Evolve]?

S&T: Yes.

G: What happened is, I’ve been so influenced in the past three years by so many great artists. Everything from Patti Smith to Leonard Cohen to Tom Waits to Diamanda Galas to Bowie, going back to Depeche Mode and the Cure and all that great music that once was. I wanted to steer away from everything else. I wanted to sing, you know. That was really my passion.

S&T: Then there’s definitely intent there, because you definitely sing more on this album.

G: There was intent to sing, but it was definitely a natural process.

At this point, we ended the first part of our interview so Gil could head out for a signing session. We picked up just a few days later by phone.

S&T: Where are you right now?

G: Washington, D.C.

S&T: You guys are playing today, right?

G: Actually, we played this morning.

S&T: Which slot?

G: We played first today.

S&T: Ouch. Oh, but first slot is now 10:30, right [ed.'s note, with the departure of Grade 8, Nothingface and Depswa from the tour, and the addition of E.Town Concrete, the first slot of the day had been pushed back from 9:30AM to 10:30AM]?

G: 10:30, but there were at least 3,000 people out there and we sold like 200 CDs.

S&T: Really?

G: So it was fucking awesome. We ripped it out there today.

S&T: That’s cool. There’s something to be said about those first couple of slots, because the kids that are there that early are there for the music. They haven’t been standing around in the sun all day, they’re not drunk...

G: Absolutely. It’s like they’re ready, they’re anxious, they came early purposely to see the show, and the first band that goes on, they’re gonna go crazy. That’s how it felt today. I knew as soon as I got on that stage today and they were cheering, and they didn’t even know us - you know what I mean? So I knew, like, it was going to be a great show.

S&T: Very good. Now, do you prepare any different for an early show versus a late show?

G: There is a little bit, ‘cause you’re awake and you’re thinking, like, “I’ve got to get ready” and start stretching. In the morning it’s somewhat simpler, because you wake up and it’s like, “I have to play in an hour.” It’s weird. When you wake and know you have to play in an hour, everything falls into place for some reason. But then playing later, you get more and more anxious to play, you know what I mean?

S&T: Do you get that? Like, if you know you’re playing in 8 hours, do you start counting down, 8 hours, 7 hours, 6 hours?

G: Not really. You just go with it. I never really count down until like two hours before a show. Then I say, “OK, I only have two hours to get ready,” and I start putting on my clothes, breathing, and trying to stretch. But basically this whole business is just waiting, you know? It’s waiting to play, it’s waiting for this, waiting for that. So a lot of it’s just patience, you know, being on a tour like this.

S&T: Do you still get nerves before a show?

G: I don’t get nervous, but I get excited. At this point I don’t get nervous, because I’m pretty confident about what we do and of our presence and of our show. So maybe a little nervous, but more like excitement - I want to go on, I want to have fun, I want people to see what we’re about.

S&T: More anxious really.

G: Yeah, a little anxious.

S&T: The other day I was trying to remember something I'd thought of on the way to the show but couldn't. i just remembered this morning. I was thinking [Endo's] music could be as dark as it is, and yet at the same time oddly inspirational or uplifting.

G: Yeah.

S&T: So explain that if you can. How does that happen? How do you wind up with music that is, like, inspirationally dark? [laughs]

G: Ooh, weird. I don’t know. There’s a lot of diversity and a lot of elements to this record. I think some of the songs lend themselves to a darkness but there’s still a hint of positivity. I don’t know exactly how that works. I think maybe it’s just, or maybe it’s me as a person, because I’m not schizophrenic or anything, but I can adapt to any sort of emotion. So at times it may sound happy, at times sad, at times dark. It’s kind of like every aspect of myself coming out in the music. So there might be hints of a lot of things, a lot of emotions, and that’s what this album does. It hits like every aspect of oneself. It’s really complex, I really don’t know how to explain what you said, but it’s very interesting to me and I’m happy you pointed that out. It’s great. I don’t know exactly how that happens.

S&T: You talked about writing it and going through a rough time with the insomnia and stuff, so I’d imagine that writing the lyrics had to be cathartic. And so I can’t imagine that the same thing wouldn’t come through to someone listening to it.

G: Yeah, absolutely.

S&T: Is it as cathartic singing it, or at that point are they just songs and it’s time to perform?

G: Um, it’s weird. There’s a lot of elements up there in performance. There’s singing, there’s performing, and then there’s really feeling the music. If those three elements are together in alignment or balance, you’re going to be a great performer and you’re going to have a great show because what you feel up there; if you feel good, the audience will feel good. So yeah, I guess it is in a way sort of therapeutic to sing the songs. I do get into like, if there’s a certain line in the song, I tend to bring it out. For example, if there’s a certain line that really touches a point, then I’ll be sure to emphasize it. So yeah, there’s the whole alignment thing going on and you just gotta keep conscious sometimes of what you’re saying and how you’re performing. It’s complex, it really is.

S&T: To hear you describe it, it sounds complex. But sometimes to hear other guys describe it, sometimes it doesn’t seem so. It’s interesting to me that there can be multiple approaches to somebody going up there and singing.

G: Oh yeah, there’s multiple dimensions. You’re always trying to tap into your soul, you know? Personally I’m trying to tap into my soul, like something that’s beyond me. Something where I don’t feel my physical self, but I’m actually feeling something more beyond. And if I can tap into that in every show, that’s going to be an amazing experience. And it’s usually that way.

S&T: I was going to say, I think you do, because one of the questions I had down in my notes is, “Where does Gil go on stage?”

G: Yeah, it’s weird. I’m a very mellow person, you know, but there’s definitely a lot behind who I am. As far as meeting you or anyone else regularly, I’m really normal. I grew up normally, two parents, two sisters. I think my cultural background, being Moroccan, Israeli and Parisian all at the same time, everything I do and everything that I write, it’s all out of love. As corny as that may sound. And if people can appreciate that, then I’m definitely doing the right thing. Like you just appreciating the music, taking the time to listen to it and actually go deeper than what’s on the surface is really exciting. Because I can say that there’s people out there who are actually getting it.

S&T: Well I hope they do, because to me there’s so much more to it than the first listen. I have it on my iTunes, so there’s pretty much at least three songs in regular rotation every day. I have the shortest attention span when it comes to new music, but this stuff just gets better and better, deeper and deeper, and I keep feeling something I didn’t feel or hearing something I didn’t hear. And to me, that’s gotta speak to something in the complexity of a song’s construction. Can it be too smart? Is it possible to alienate certain fans because the music is just…

G: Wow, I don’t know. Some people like the simplicity of music, you know. Some people just want to hear that certain beat or that certain lyric. They want simplicity. But I write for me, you know, I write for me and I write from experience. If it’s too much for some people, then it is, and if it’s not, great. But if people get it, that’s the most important part. We’re trying to reach a mass audience. We’re trying to reach people with our music, you know? To be honest with you, I know that we made a great album. If it goes it goes, if it doesn’t it doesn’t, but we know that it’s a great album and artistically we can say we made a great record. If they get it, they get it, if they don’t, they don’t. If it happens that we sell a million records and things start happening, then great. If it doesn’t, I’ll always know that we did something artistic.

S&T: Right. So at Ozzfest are you moving CDs?

G: We are. Actually we sold about 170, almost 200 CDs today.

S&T: That’s good.

G: And that’s just out of our live show, you know. So they’re going to radio with it next week, hopefully “Simple Lies.” We want to sell records, but we’re not going to sell out to do it, you know? I’m not going to write something simple or we’re not going to appeal to the masses just because we want to sell records.

S&T: With the second album, you had two different guys during recording. How was it different with Eli and Joe versus the other guys?

G: Um, it’s different. It’s fine actually. I think Eli is a great guitar player and a great performer and writes a lot of great riffs. And Joe is a very “feel” drummer. He really feels the music and it’s important that a drummer and a singer really lock. I think the most important element of a band is the drummer and the singer, because those two have to be really good in order for the band to achieve something. So it’s good that the chemistry is there now. There’s really something there, even though we’re all from very diverse backgrounds.

S&T: Better chemistry or just different?

G: Much better chemistry. Much better. Different as well, but better.

S&T: What was their contribution to the album musically?

G: I think that Joe, our drummer now, compared to our other drummer... Our other drummer was very into hardcore music, so that lends itself to a harder edged album. Joe’s into everything from Jeff Buckley to Sly and the Family Stone, so there’s a lot of elements there and he actually could open our mind as a unit to go somewhere else. And we totally went somewhere else.

S&T: What kind of stuff are you guys listening to now?

G: What’s in my CD player is... I have a side project called Lisbon, which is really cool, very moody. You would probably love it. I’m listening to that because it’s an amazing record, I’m listening to the new Radiohead, “Hail to the Thief,” which is an amazing record. Um, I have this Jeff Buckley live bootleg that I’m listening to. Um, what else? That’s about it, I guess.

S&T: Tell me more about Lisbon.

G: Lisbon is very moody, very... I hate to say drug-induced, but it makes you feel like you’re on drugs. I mean, I’ve never done heroin before, but I can imagine what it feels like just by listening to this music. [laughter] It’s very dreamy, it’s very seductive and dark and it’s amazing. And I need to send you a copy.

S&T: Please do. Thanks for your time, Gil.

G: Thanks, man. Thank you so much for the great review and the great questions and like, really going deep into this. I really appreciate it.

S&T: Oh, it’s our pleasure. I really enjoy what you guys are doing. It was a pleasure meeting you and good luck the rest of the way. Gil, thanks so much.

G: OK, thanks a lot.

interview by scott sisti